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When you are pioneering anything or introducing new ideas to the culture, you get criticized, you do.
Yeah. Did you hear about that?
I didn't find the one. I found someone, I respected and we made it. The one in a sort of longing. Kind of view of love, people understand each other, as if by Magic, nothing in itself, is addictive on and and, and everything could be addictive. If there's an emptiness in that person that needs to be
filled. I now know that
nobody changes
Until they change their energy and when you change your energy, you change your
life.
I'm Gwyneth Paltrow. This is the goop podcast bringing together thought leaders culture Changers, creatives Founders and CEOs scientists, doctors healers, and Seekers here to start conversations because simply asking questions and listening has the power to change the way. We see the world. Here we go.
My guest today is the Kim Kardashian. I love getting a chance to sit down with Kim and learn more about her inner life. She told me about how her adolescent years shaped her, and about her special relationship with her father. I asked him about how she manages social media with her children today, and if she sees herself getting married again, we talked about how she approaches her different businesses, the launch of her skin care line and why she diligently began pursuing a law degree.
Let's get to my conversation with Kim Kardashian.
I'm so interested in you internally and like how you work and what goes on and I'm sort of less interested in the world's reaction to you. If that makes sense. I feel like at a time when I'm trying to just focus and chill and
Go on ski trips with my kids and just hang out. I feel like I've just been like, put in these narratives, you know, of situations when you can't really control it. Yeah. And I'm just like, I don't know how to get myself out of the narrative but just keep my head down and stay focused.
I think you actually do a beautiful job because the other thing that I've observed about you is that you seem not to be reactive your free thinker and I almost think like you having that level of like, freedom of thought.
Thought could be threatening to people, right? Okay. God, I have so many things to ask you. First of all, I love your podcast. It's really great. And when I was first looking for it, and I searched on, I didn't realize it was on Spotify. So I've on Apple and I was like, Kim Kardashian podcast in the search and there's like a million podcast that are
Like this one talking about this part, you know, they're like all these like ass that revolve around sort of talking about your life and it's struck me that I was like gosh that the industry that is you and the sort of concentric circles of that are so massive now, and I just wonder like when you like before this whole thing started and you are like a teenager in California,
what?
Like, feel like feeling, what were your dreams? What were you kind of striving for? What did you want to study? And how did you envision yourself as like a grown-up.
So in high school, I went to an all-girls Catholic, High School Marymount. How you doing son? Cell with all my besties and it was so much fun. It was like the dream childhood I had the best life. Courtney was a grade above me and we just had all of our same friends and I thought life was so
Oh, good. I love to have little side hustles all the time. Like, I would always make these hair accessories and sell them at Fred Segal, and I just like love doing these little entrepreneurial things. And then, when I turned 16, my dad made me sign a contract with him. Everything was about a contract, so I had to sign a contract. If I got a car, I was responsible for washing it once a week and gassing it once a week. And if I crashed it, I was responsible for paying for that. So I did hit
one and I had to get a job to pay for it and I got a job at a clothing store in the valley called body and it's sold like you know D and G and Frankie be jeans and Diesel and all these like fun Brands and I really loved fashion. And then I opened up a store for them in Calabasas and loved clothes and fashion and
Did you like retail like the
internet retail? Yes, I loved retail. I love. I mean I did everything from like unpacking everything and steaming and hanging and sales and then when my sister's wanted to open up a clothing store, I did it with them. They first, we're going to do it on their own and I kind of pushed my way into that situation and then at the same time our show started happening. So how
did that happen? Like how did the show come to be?
So my stepdad did a show called, I'm a celebrity, get me out of here, okay? It's in Australia, okay? And they had asked me to be on a version of that, okay? Why? And that didn't work out. I don't know. It was just kids of okay, people in the business, okay. And I remember my dad, and I spoke a lot about, like, what I wanted to do and I was really into all of his law stuff. But we talked about
About me, not going into that and he thought that that would be really stressful for me, why? He just thought that it was a really intense job. He knew I didn't love school that much and he
I got into college on the east coast and he said like I know you got in and that's amazing but I really don't think you should go because I know you're going to fall in love with someone and get married and you're never going to come home. So I said, okay and Courtney went to college in Dallas and I just I wasn't a party girl. I didn't love it and I would go visit and it was always the wildest parties and everyone was so wasted and I thought this isn't what I want to do with my life. I don't
To go to college for these reasons. Mmm, and I loved, I was in retail and I worked at my dad's office. Okay. And I just did both for a long time, I just always loved getting up and having a purpose and no matter what my job was at his office and making his coffee. And that was just what I love to do
while you're paying off the
accident. Yes,
yes. So he really instill that kind of work ethic in you. Yeah and that sense that like there,
It was a right. If you get something, you're responsible for it and what that entails and sweet. It sounds like you were really close to him. Yeah. So, I
mean, you know what that's like, it's the best relationship you could ever have, and I'll never. I'm so so, so grateful, like I feel so like I was 23 when he passed away 22, so, we its young, but like, I'm so grateful that we had so much time. Like, I learned, I learned,
Everything that
I possibly could have from him. Wow yeah. Do you feel like
Do you still feel him around you?
Yeah. Totally and I love going to mediums its I love it. I mean we were on a chat together and we invite during quarantine we were on this group chat and there was a lot of people and we could bring someone in I don't. Were you ever on any of the medium calls? I don't think it's like John Edward no ideas that where I
was bummed about that or
the Long Island Medium.
Arisa. Yeah, I was on with her. Yeah. Right. That's one of the really thick accent. Yes. I uh yeah, I think I was on. We are some of it anyway. So I
just love those glimpses of any kind of connection. Yeah, I always feel a strong connection. It's never, it's never left me.
Mine's been sort of impermanent. I don't know why it's sort of. I feel like it kind of Ebbs and flows and yeah, I don't know. I, I want to feel him more than I actually feel him around and maybe or maybe it's just
So painful when I do feel him that like if he ever had any intense dreams, I have. But they they've they've really kind of subsided in the last. I mean it's like if all yours, right? How it was, how many years ago were you 23? 20 years ago? So, yeah, my dad died 20 years ago to, so it's like
it's a long time. I've only have one really intense dream, that felt really real and it answered a lot of questions that I needed answered. They always say that like, there's this one dream.
That you'll have that will let them know they're okay and choices that they've made and apologize for anything. And I had that one, and I always just like felt so grateful for those. But I'll with the medium, all get little bits and pieces, I just always am thankful or like grateful when something really amazing happens. I always like to thank my dad, you know, like I know you're up there helping out. Thank you,
so nice. Yeah. So,
Did you feel like you knew what you were getting into when you agreed to be? I mean you couldn't possibly have known right? That. Like I kind of did you did
I so my best friend. I've told this story before but my best friend Allison.
God, it was like 91, and I remember this, we're watching The Real World. Maybe it was like, 89, and the real world came out. The first one. The first one, one. And I was like, this is what I want to do. Wow, and I said the Allison, this is what I want to do. You found your calling? I said, when we're 18, can we please make a video and let's go on the real world together, and she was like, babe, I love you. It's not what I want to do, but her dad's a manager. So she's like, I'll get my dad to call someone at MTV.
We can totally get you on the real world. My God. And I would say to her and my friends I just feel like our life is so interesting or different in the dynamic of all of us. And we always heard that from people, write my story about how my stepdad was on the show and then I was asked to be on the show, a producer of that kept on saying you guys need a reality show, right? And then one of my mom's good friends from New York. Kathie Lee Gifford call was staying with us one weekend.
And all the kids are running around, like, like we normally did and she was like, you guys, this house is so insane. I've never seen anything like it. We're calling Ryan Seacrest, my friend. And we're gonna, you have to do a reality show. And so they, she called Ryan, got us on the show, and I kind of knew like, Courtney didn't really want to be on, but because of that, she shared so much because she didn't care. Right, she actually didn't care what anyone thought about her. So, she was able to
even though she was going to maybe not be on right ended up, she gave a lot of herself and her relationship and we all were just
down for the
ride.
And so were there, like in your mind, what? We're like, the kpis, we're doing the show, or what, we're like, the things where you're thinking. If we do this show, I hope the outcome is XY and z, or was it just like no. Let's just see what
happens. We thought we were going to just be on for, like, maybe a season. We didn't even think of a season two. We didn't even know that was a possibility. We thought? Right now, this is fun, right? We're going to do it. I think we were like a filler show.
That they needed to fill a slot on the network and it just kept on showing us so many different
things
in this life and we just said, we'll stop doing it when it stops being fun, right? And there's been moments where we've all needed like our personal sit out kind of writing of the Season where we're not. So intensely involved. If we're personally just having a hard time.
But there's so many family members to pick that up, right? And then we ultimately share with that is whether it's a family member transitioning or something, really serious. That we don't even know what's really happening and we all figure it out together, right? But there's been some really serious moments that have really helped other people, right? And I think that's kind of driven us to continue. And so how do you sort of adjudicate? This is
Private and I don't want it on because as I said, I've started watching this new on with apple and there's some things that you you clearly have boundaries around, right. Like there are certain areas like your it sort of you're starting to date someone but it's clear like you don't want it on TV, right? It's like you're not ready to.
I think that's the hard part, right? Because like if it was us if you're dating someone they obviously know who
you are and that
you have a
A show, right? But I don't think they're expecting. Let me bring a camera and I just I want to get to know someone first, I want to like privately, get to know someone. What if I go on a few dates and hate this person and would never want them to be on the show. Like that's a serious decision to even talk about it but
that's like really what's happening in your life and yeah, putting it on like you're making the choice not to put it on.
Well, I mean, I was in a relationship before and I
Decided to talk about it. So I think that the tricky part is
once your photographed, right?
And your scene out and you don't talk about it and you don't show
it. How are you? Yeah, then you're hiding something, right?
So I think this show the Kardashians is really good because we've been able to really share so much so many other sides of us.
To where let you couldn't that you didn't last time for
example. Yeah, I think the E audience, just liked a different. Maybe a jokey or side, we're still like that but if I talked about my law school Journey, that would bore them to death,
right? And here is
just like completely us more documentary-style more, what we want to do. But then, that gives me the beauty to have boundaries, right? And to take my time even if at some point I'll get there but that's on my time of when I want to share.
Share that and I think that as we've grown up, we've realized the boundaries that we need. Just in life of what we share with the media, we have our friends, we have a completely private Circle in life and do what we want to do. And that's so important also to have that. And so the beauty is you can show whatever you want and keep private whatever you want. And
then it's interesting because it creates its created this like insane.
In marketing flywheel of sorts, right? It's like you show your life and then it creates all of this like excitement and interest in who you are. And then you guys have been able to create these amazing Brands and like Drive product. But is there a point in the flywheel where you like are like? Okay, well, I better I need to do X Y and Z to sort of keep because it's essentially like all about the fame at the end of it is that like, for lack of a better,
A word or the like the Allure of you guys as celebrities and that's like such a key part of how the whole flywheel works, right? So, is there ever like a time where you're like, we better, you know, let them see more to drive more
interest. There's none of those conversations because I think that no matter what something, I think. Fortunately, and unfortunately, something always happens right in our lives.
Right. When I mean, I remember
I don't even know what season it is now but as a family we would sit down and have these like group family meetings where it would just be like hey guys you know Scott would say I want to quit smoking okay I'm like oh my God I'm shooting whatever magazine let's cover that and we kind of all just map out as far as we could out what we had coming up and this one season we just were like okay guys like all this stuff is like I hope it's interesting to people. It's nothing.
Think real easy. It's just one of those times in our lives where it's pretty chill. And then, literally the next week, like Caitlin came out. And we were like, what? Oh my God. Like, and it was like the craziest season, but it's like, even when you think, okay, we're just going to get to chill. Something happens and I don't know why the cameras are always on there. Even if we eat there, just happened to be there whether I'm in the gym and I get a text message and I see something about a family member
Just the way that our luck is, it happens to happen, and we can say, you know what, that's not something, I'm comfortable showing, right? But at the end of the day it's always out there,
right? So better to have it through your
narrative, absolutely. And show the truth of what's going on internally and to show that we are a family that goes through a lot of things and we lean on each other. I think at the end of the day, whether it's like fame or the
Ducks and everything that we're talking about, it's just a family business. Yeah. And that's what drives everything yeah, more than the fame more than anything and
well the I mean the, the fame, what the fame brings, right? Like the the influence that you guys have the in the followers and the, you know, and therefore like there's a channel that's created and then you guys can have these incredible businesses. It's yeah, well, because it's a totally new business model.
You know, and people respond so much to what you guys are doing and putting into the world, and I just think it's so cool. And it's like all of these amazing women. And then, you know, you see your Sisterhood together and it's very special and weird and different and like, yeah, it's amazing and it all kind of started from my grandma. I mean, just seeing
her like, run a clothing store and just the the dynamic of her and my grandpa and she'd get up every day and he'd watch us.
Us, you know, actually go to work. And it was just really interesting to see that because that was the opposite with my dad's side of the family and he was the one that would get up and work and my mom never worked. She was a mom, raising all of the babies and being the best housewife, and Mom, but then, when he passed away, her whole dynamic had to shift and change, and she had to figure it out, and it was really interesting. Were they married? When he passed no, other know, she was married to my stepdad. Okay.
Okay, but they were like best friends, they were really close. I don't get divorced. I think she was 17 when they met. He was 12 years older than her. They fell in love, she moved from San Diego to Beverly Hills. She had this great big life and then I think at 30 she had had four kids, kind of felt like she just wanted to explore a little bit after being with my dad since she was 17. Wow,
I understand my did, I
totally understand. And that was he heartbroken? Yeah. And I don't think he ever really got over her and he would say that, you know, and he tried. And you know, but
we'll get right back to the chat.
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Okay, let's get back to the conversation. Do you is your dad at your relationship with your dad? Is that like do you hold that as like, on some level? I always did like, hold that is like I want. I would love this in a partner like that. The polarity of that love and my dad's until early
not. But yes, maybe that's what. Maybe that's what I need to do. Yeah, yes.
That's probably what I will do. So that you are the guys
like that you've been attracted to, you would say, fundamentally different to him to your dad.
Yes. In the past. But I mean, you always look at your dad is like the most unique, the most special, the smartest person. There's definitely qualities. For sure, what I've seen from people are what I wanted from people in the past, but that should be the standard. I think. So, I
I feel like I found that in my second marriage, you know, like that kind of uncondition ality. Yeah. Which I
really you can see that. And I love that and I love you guys and if anyone's listening and doesn't know a lot about Brad, he is the most
Thoughtful, birthday message. Person any time we were on this chat and any time it was someone's birthday. He would write a full paragraph of the best qualities about you and make you feel so seen and heard. So we just got a birthday message, he's a good guy, could imagine that. You have a really good relationship,
it's, I feel really lucky and I feel like I I always would have hoped to have that thing that I had with my dad.
Add Loft. In my case, I had to do a lot of work on myself before I was able to really accept love like that because I guess on some level I always thought like if you think there's something wrong with you and some level and someone is totally adoring and unconditional you think there's something weird about it? Yeah so I had to do like a ton of work to rewire my so worth it, I know so worth it. So would you get married again?
I don't know your
romantic. I am. I am I have this like fantasy in my head, like, fourth times a charm. It's gonna, it's gonna work out. It definitely went
four times. Yeah. You've been married three already. Yeah, I thought you were married to. Who was here one. I
was you like to say in Vegas,
like a Britney Spears. What? I know it
lasted like a few years. It wasn't really like that. But yeah.
And so your dad was right. You were gonna get married first.
First chance. You got?
Yeah, totally I feel like honestly my last marriage was like my first like real. I think I was the first one. I just don't know what was happening. The second one. I felt like I wanted to be married so badly because all my friends were at that place and that's where I should have been, right? And I didn't accept that. That's just wasn't where I was and realized that was okay. And then
And now I feel like I will definitely take my time and I would be okay for like a forever partnership as well. I have a lot of girlfriends that have been married, don't like the experience of it or that, or the ending of it and don't want to go through that again. So are fine with a forever partner. I think I would definitely want. I would want a marriage but I'm so happy to take my time. And do you feel like you're the kid thing like, is behind you? So
That's
or we do. I do know, I do I could you pause there. Just I just don't want to ever say, Never Say Never, I agree with. I'm at the lake obviously right at the end of that conversation and because I said I would have to have someone in my life for a while in order to make that decision.
But you can freeze some huevos, I know but
it's always an offer, I think. Embryos are the best way to go everyone. I know.
No, that is frozen eggs and thawed them out. They haven't been made it through the
process. I've had a couple friends. If
so I'm like, what's the point of that? And then the point is that I don't have the embryo, right? That I would want to do that with. So whatever's meant to be, will
be, that's true. I have absolute faith. That you will be able to manifest whatever you want. I have no
doubt, I'm taking my time. I really do want to be single for a few
years, I think that's great. I think, you know,
We place this high level of importance on being coupled up in the society. I think it leads to people feeling a like I should be in a relationship when that's not necessarily the case and we shouldn't always always be in a relationship all the time and you miss such an incredible period of self-exploration. If you're always in a relationship because the truth of the matter is if you're really deeply coupled up with someone like your making sacrifices your
You're putting them first, you're going places, they want to go, you know, there's a give-and-take and they're doing the same for you, right? So it's beautiful and you're creating like this third entity together, but you lose the ability to fully operate like on a
solo Mission. And yeah, like just I'm on a good solo Mission. Good have Mike. I've like either sisters or friends that were all in the same place and that feels so good and fun, and I'm going to soak up.
Every minute of it. And I'm I feel like I'm just in a really good place. That's how I've always been at. Like, I'm the type of person that no matter what it is, I'm always in a good place, like that's where I'm supposed to be and have time. So even if it seems challenge a
sanguine like that, it's yeah, cool. I've
always been like that. Do you need
like to have a flirt going on the side, like a tech kind of? Yeah, that kind of Romantics. I always was like that too.
Yeah, yeah. I do.
That's good. That'll get you through a cold matter. Totally totally. Can I ask you about something about your kids because I've, you know, in this age of social media, my kids like our kids, they're probably same generation minor, but minor on the older and obviously and
I've always been like really freaked out about social media and like showing them in the public and them being on social media and getting. So, like, a, how do you, how are you comfortable? Like, you're comfortable with your kids in the public? Yeah. So how, what is your thinking around that? Like your
You're just like this is there, this is their lot in life and his I think I get so hung up on like wanting to protect their feet and arms and yeah and I feel like I haven't had a clear like feeling around how to do this and you know like would you let your kids be public on Instagram or are they or I mean I don't even know. But
like so. I think every family is different. Yeah. Even within my family, how Courtney operate.
How Khloe operates, how Kylie can't like, we always say, every family is different, right? So whether it's the snacks that were allowed to eat or even a little things, right? So with social media, it is hard because all of our cousins, all the, cuz my nieces and nephews, they're all best friends with my kids, so they're all the same ages. So if Penelope has a tick, tock North wants a tick, tock, and all the girls at school, have a tick tock. However, I have made a rule with their dad about it, you know, he's not
not happy about that. I respect that but it can only be on my phone, okay? It's not her own totally. And it's not something where she can scroll and look at things. And it's, that's my
worry, to is like what is the feedback that these kids are getting? And the yeah, on top of that. Like if they're famous kids, like when your parents are famous therefore by proxy, they're like well known kids like how will you protect them against?
All of that noise
or yeah, it's hard. I mean I know we don't do comments, we do because she's not scrolling on and she's the only kid that would be old enough to really be on it and have her phone. She's 90 case which is really young and but the way that she is so creative and the way that she loves to do Tick-Tock and do these videos and she'll take my phone and she'll do skin care stuff and she'll do. She loves special effects makeup. So she'll be like doing these like
Scars and faces and bullet wounds. And like she takes classes on it, and that's what she loves to do. So she loved to show it and she loves to just it makes her so happy that
She's so innocent and so many ways that if I give her this creative outlet and she just loves to do funny videos. I mean, she'll do makeup and do whole movies with her friends like how we used to do with like old you know, VHS has and like but she'll do them and on the on a phone and upload it and then they'll edit it and they'll spend so much time adding music to it and special effects onto the. I don't even know how to do it with all these, like, photoshopping like iMovie kind of things where you can add the music in.
To its, she's like the advanced director. Like she just loves to do this stuff and so I let her, I take it as more of a creative thing, as long as it's age-appropriate, and they're having fun and it's so annoying because I just won't have my phone for so long special, take it and be doing that. So it's something that the cousins and all their friends love to, they'll stay up all night long, all their friends and just do these, like, silly fun, but why do they have to do?
It into the world. I guess like,
I don't even think they realize that because they're not seeing comments and they're not seeing right? Really what's going on? I think it's almost as if they don't even discuss it at school with their friends, it's just something that they love to do and if they're monitored, I'm okay with i as far as I think, for a minute, we tried to have an Instagram on my phone for our dogs that she would do. And then she would like just
Pictures of the dogs and like outfits, and in different scenes and that wasn't working for me. I was like, this is just too much access, right? Right. So that only lasted like 2 days, right? And I found a Groove with her Tick-Tock, as long as it's me and her together, right? And I'm there, and that works for now
supervising.
It's a crazy world. I don't, I don't deny that
I guess just to their like, these kids are digitally, native like this is here to stay.
We can't wish that they were being raised in an era without social media. So I guess in a sense it's good to understand. It is good to understand like what your personal boundaries are with it growing up excetera,
but I also think they see that it's healthy. That when I'm at home, I'm not on my phone the whole time. So it's not like I'm sitting there checking everything and seeing I posted something on Instagram and what my likes are like, they're seeing my habits of being super present so they'll be
Be a week two weeks where I will go on a trip and they won't even have their phone. The whole time
when you talk about your social media do you is there a strategy to that? It is so not intrinsic, like it's not hard for me and I know like have to do this to for my business and it's really
important and it's late and you're so good at that like for, but I'm so bad at someone that doesn't want to put their whole life out there because I think
You give enough and you give like it's intriguing and people see it. I mean we can judge all day long and I could say oh my God I would never post that or that's way too much or I cringe when people start, you know, fighting on the internet and all of that. And I've been in the middle of it, you know, where I'm just like, I, you know, my number like just call me and I don't like that kind of stuff, but as far as like,
To me I look at Instagram like a magazine and I love posting what I think. I would put in a magazine spread, that's a great lens. Like if I was an editor but I have different moods sometimes, I'll post vacation pics and then I'll say, oh my God, like, that's way too much. I can't believe I've been posting so much in a bikini. I just don't want that and then I won't do it for a while. And then I'll say, oh, I missed that, you know, and if
that part of the strategy like, like,
You're so you're the master obviously of social media. All of you guys are so I can thank you. Do you think
about? I think it involves. I think it's just to me it shows like what my mood was. I don't like to delete things also. Okay, so I love to look back and see like where I was at even a year ago and even down to like there was a time when years ago when I love to put white borders around my pictures, to me, it's just more of like a creative visual Outlet. Like I don't take it that seriously.
So I'll post and I'll never check the comments because I'm not trying to see a reaction. I just want to put out what I want to put out, so I use them for different reasons, right? I just got into watching tic toc because I'm forced because my daughter forces me to do like one or two every morning.
You put it on. You, put something on Tick. Tock, I don't even have.
It's humiliation. Even go. Look, she makes me do these dances. These things like the raw, me every like
Get out of bed, even if I don't want to do it, she forces me.
But that's so interesting too. Because that's like, obviously a very organic thing but then I'm sure there are people who are like analyzing, you know, what you're posting like. Well, this is such great content because it's like the raw content and then, there's the bathing suit and the photo shoot or whatever and it's. Yeah, but it obviously
and it's all different
and that's probably why it works so well. And there's,
I mean, I remember there was a time when you know, I started to really study law and I started to spend some
Time in the White House and people were like, are you going to internally? Are you going to stop posting like a bikini photo? Are you going to stop posting this? And I was like, absolutely not right? Like,
I want to be me. It's just my form of expression to put whatever I want out there. And this is also you
combine archetypes, like you combine these FEMA archetypes and we talked about this a lot at Google because historically women are held in one archetype, you can be maternal or you can be intellectual or you can be sexual or you can be and it's like the amalgamation of those things. And the challenge that's inherent and like passing the bar. And
And wearing a bikini at the same time is so punk rock studying for the bar in a bikini. I'm sure they're like classes on like you know, in universities about like Kardashian feminism and what does it mean? I think it's really cool. I think it's really,
really strong and even intentional. Yeah, just this is who I am. I'll never be that. I mean, the fact that that's why it worked, take the bar in my pajamas because of the times we were at
home like
Oh my God. I'm so grateful. You know, for that experience, not for covid. No anyone to take that the wrong way, but I'm grateful for that. I can just add the time that I'm doing this. These are the opportunities and
I just I'm doing it my way. Yeah. And there's always a way to do like if you want something bad enough there's definitely a way to figure it out and I had those conversations with my dad about how much I hated school and how he doesn't, you know, think that I'm going to sit there for years and law school and it's like a big moment for me, just inside to be, like, I fucking did that,
and so, you know, yeah.
Like, I can't believe it.
It. Like I can't even I hated school so much. I was just not a school person. Yeah. But the things that I'm learning pertain to my real life so much that whether I'm learning about, you know, I'm taking like real property right now and the course and it's like yeah of course I'm leasing this house and this that like I know exactly the laws now so great because it at this phase in my life, it just like pertains to my life. So,
Makes so much more sense. And I'm so happy. I did school and went to law school the way that I am.
So what is your like, you have all the things that you're working on right now? And again, the podcast is so it's really great, I listen to it. When I drive to Santa Barbara, it's on, it's become like in my rotation now and how are you, what do you love working on the most? And also I'd love to know to like with skin how that started and was that come out of your
or Wellness routine. I mean obviously you're meticulous about how you look and you're beyond Flawless and so it's like does that come out of did that come out of
that? Yeah. So I wanted to
Launch skincare always and I was going to do that. Even when I had kkw Beauty, I had color and I had fragrance as a separate business kkw fragrance and then I was going to launch kkw skin and I just felt like it was because they were going to be three different partners and Manufacturing Partners. It was going to be really hard to have one house for all of that in one place and I really felt like one team. Yeah, well it was three different teams
and
so, I thought I really want
One team and not have to go to different offices. I want one team that's all in-house that there's one website. First of all, managing three different, Instagram accounts, three different social. Yeah, that's a lot and telling everyone go by here and spend this shipping and product and go. But here, I just wanted one place. Finally got it. Yeah. So in order to do that because of my contractual deals, I had to change my name and start one brand and
I picked the name skin spelled SK, K N4 Kim Kardashian, very cool. Feel like all my Brands like skims it always has like Kim or something and uh and we're starting with skincare but it's mainly everything for the skin. So it'll be color cosmetics and fragrances well into the other brands. They, I ended those relationships because my contracts were up with those Partners. So it was either I was going to renew or I was just going to start all over and do it together.
With a team that had done my kkw be like my whole in-house team. Okay. So
they migrated over and then you. Yes, it's nice. I feels like a fresh
start. Yeah, I love a fresh start. I love launching a brand. It's something that I absolutely love to do. It is so much work, as you know, and I wanted to bring especially launching and starting with skin care. I thought that I have learned so much in my journey and
And I've had the best facialist, the best estheticians. The tried every laser I've tried
everything. You better better. Send me all the
contact. Yes. And I wanted to borrow that up. Stop stop. You look amazing. No you do. And I wanted to bottle that up and take everything that I've learned and work with my favorite aesthetician and and chemist who really developed products that were next level, like she had she'd
With everyone and she was like, I hope people don't just take this as, like, some celeb Rand that you're putting your name on it because these formulas are she's like, some of the best that I've ever seen in such active ingredients. That so good. I hope everyone just really enjoys and gets it. Yeah. And so I loved like, taking my time and launching this 9 step system that we really use. I know it seems like a
lot. Do you do it every day? Every morning, and every night, you do really literally one.
Now once you do it, you see how
I like your skin is glowing. You just can't, you can't look. Yeah. You just I start my and I know I'm wearing makeup now. I don't wear as much makeup as I did right now that I've gotten to my skin and I think that kind of started in quarantine. Yeah and just like having nowhere to go. Yeah, and really developing.
Something that made me feel really confident. Being is
interesting during quarantine to not I mean I barely wear makeup ever anyway but so lucky. Oh my God. You don't need make-up please. But
it was more of like an I guess I love makeup. Yeah, I love the. Yeah, I love the process. I love sitting on my Glam chair. I'm yeah, I really hate
it. Like I want to scrape it off my face. I'm like such a tomboy in that way.
I've started to feel that way. Yeah, and that's kind of a good that is good because I like just wasn't like that.
I love the process like when I'm out but for my daily stuff, I
don't care. You, don't deal way that I used to
know. What, isn't it interesting that?
Like, you know, I imagine if you're in quarantine and day after day, you're not getting in full hair and makeup, right? And you're not or were you filming and stuff?
No. Only filming with are like, we buy phones iPhones on, tripods. Like, I don't care to not, like, if I'm not in makeup, I don't care. I don't have to have my hair and makeup done to film my show. Right.
Right. Right. Right.
Right right? Yeah, but so the formulas, it's nine. It's a 9-step thing. You do it literally
re there's some there's an oil, that's a more a day and night so it's really only eight steps. If you do everything in one is a scrub, okay? So you wouldn't use that every day so it's really seven steps. Okay. And it's while you sent my summon
hours stole it. So yeah I'll send you some more
and you'll just I just want you to try it. I'm going to like all together and then I do
got me thinking I'm going
to and you'll
Like oh shit. This is really, really
good. Yeah, I'm gonna look like you by the time I wish okay. Oh, you know what, I just want to ask you about too, is when you were studying for the bar which I thought was so interesting and you were so diligent about it. I remember when you were about to take it the last time and you were like, oh my God, we were texting and I was thinking like what? Drove your as you said you didn't love school. Like, what was driving you
You to do that. Did it feel like if I if I pass like all it'll be a stamp of approval or validation on some level. It will it be like me proving myself to my Father in heaven? Like why what drove you like
that? I and all honesty. I went to the White House to help. I remember try to get clemency for a woman that we were successful in doing, but I really had no idea what they were talking about the whole time. Interesting. And I was called back to have
It's like big clemency meeting at the Roosevelt Room in the White House and it was all of these like really smart people whether they were in politics or attorneys and it was to try to perfect the clemency system because it does take so long and everyone wanted my opinion in my advice but they're all talking in such lawyer Lee language. And I just was I was never afraid to like raise my hand and be like, what does that mean? Wait, what are you guys?
Saying, but a lot of the times after so many questions I would text my attorney sitting next to me being like what what does that mean? And then I kind of just felt like why if I didn't have to bring someone to translate for me and I didn't have to take that extra step and time is everything and I just learned it for myself. There's so much more I can do and I just wanted to be independent wanted to be free weight from that cool
that it was born out of your passion for social justice.
This reform. Yeah, I mean I just of course, it would have been amazing to. I was always super interested when my friends were having pool parties and swimming in the pool laying out and my dad was out of town. I'd be up in his office, like going through his evidence books because I was so nosy. And I wanted to see crime scene photos and I wanted to see, like stuff. I shouldn't have been looking at. Yeah. And that was all my friends. Would make fun of me and be like, get out here like we're all laying out, so it's not.
Not surprising to anyone that I would make that move if you know me. Right? I call my friends. Yeah, but the time that it takes it's like a four-year program to Bar exams at least 20 hours a week. And this time I had to double up on courses. So instead of doing two at a time, I'm doing four at a time because we lost some time with me, not
passing. Oh right away, right?
So each time you have to wait, six months before another test and so I
Just over a year there. So it's like my main thing that I do right now, that's your main thing. I have my office that I study in and I do three hours a day with a professor every single day. Wow, six days a week. So cool. And then yeah. And it's honestly, my time also now because I had such a routine for me, it's my time to not have my phone to train myself. That way to be away from everyone, when my kids are in school, I dropped them off. And if they're like, mom, stay.
Today. And if my, you know, little or ones get a little needy for me to stay for a little. I'm like, I have school myself, right? So you guys are in school and I'm in school, and when I have my midterms, they're studying for tests and I'm like, you guys were in this together. That's like, we can do this
so good,
and if they're complaining, I'm like, I'm going to complain right there with because I'm just as tired of
this and what else is your day? Like, do you do work and Care color? I want to hear the whole thing, the
whole day. I wake up at five forty
every day.
Armed with an alarm system. So cute, when I interviewed her for the podcast. I asked her this question. I love said, no alarm. She said, she wakes up with. She put a dream is a
wish, your totally her.
Yeah. God, your voice is so good.
So
good. So what's your alarm? You have
a know. My alarm is the standard annoying. Okay, wake you up. Okay, well, armed and I work at
At 6:54. Okay. And then wait.
But do you have a coffee? Do you have hot water and lemon? What's your nothing? You've nothing until after you work out. Nothing. Okay. Yeah. What is your
workout? It changes every day. But it's like, I do mostly weightlifting. Okay. And so, it's just like a body part. Today, I did shoulders and back, okay. Then I'll probably do legs, okay,
by the way, tomorrow. No, Pilates yoga.
I love Pilates, but I'll do that on the
Okay, so that's my weekend. 1 do cardio, not really, I do like ten minute warm-up of treadmill, okay.
Or StairMaster. Okay.
And then then it's 7:00 on the dot. I come in,
I have a
coffee, don't really have time to shower. I have to get right in to wake up, the kids. There's always be plain or with know. So I just started drinking coffee. When I started school like a year ago and now, and I don't like
coffee. Brad. Just started drinking
coffee. Like it means 40s. What is
Is it like
like has black coffee? But I've never like had coffee
and so, I need like, oat milk tsukuri, instill ish. Okay. When I'm at home, okay,
I eat plant-based. Okay,
when I leave, I don't put that pressure on me. So if I if it's like the option of hey there's an oat
milk latte, something I
prefer that now. Okay, and I prefer like beyond meat over regular me, right? So if there's those options you will,
If there's nothing out Ali, okay? And I just don't I like that for me. She's a flexitarian. I like that. Yeah, that's really good. But a majority of my time is vegan. Okay.
So you have your oat milk latte. You wake up your
kid. It's so sweet. It's like probably as a drop of coffee. What do you put in there? Just like
the it's already sweet though. Milk
okay. Yeah. And then wake up. The kids have about 15 minutes to 20 minutes to do my daughter's hair. She always needs
Needs me to do her hair. Everyone gets ready. We have about five minutes to do a tick tock. Oh, that's gas. It has to him every morning, every morning and
Have breakfast really quickly. Okay, it's sitting there waiting, which what on the table? Oh,
it's vegan. But is it also is there
again, sausage? Now you're gluten. You eat gluten. Might be gluten, okay? It could be anything from like an acai type Bowl too.
I don't really eat that much in the morning. I don't only if I'm starving. Okay. So, but breakfast is my favorite meal. I just usually have a bite of theirs, but they all have to eat. Okay, I drink my coffee. Get in the car, drop them off. Then I come home and study, right? So I have three hours of studying starting at 9:30 every
day. Okay. And the goal there is to you, take another exam. I have to take one more bar exam. Okay? There's
another. So there's like the halfway mark. Okay, and then two more years and then it oh man.
Other bar exam. So now I can practice with like a primary attorney. So I can't like represent anyone by myself. Okay. I once I pass this second bar, it's like the real bar that everyone takes. Okay, I'll take that like with everyone else and then I'm like officially and okay, got it and while I'm in that is when I have my full breakfast.
Okay,
yeah. So, I eat study study with the professor
and then if you're filming, does that,
then if I'm filming,
After work and then kids and then School pickup, do you come when I must have I do drop off every single morning. I pick up as much as I can, but I'm always at the activities so you can write. I don't pick up.
Then it's like, okay, I'll meet you at soccer. I'll meet a basketball ballet
gymnastics. You have four. So you're going in all different
directions and always home for dinner.
Do you all eat together? We do to family dinner. Totally retire. You
have TV on during family ever, I would say. No. That's my thing is, like, sometimes we'll all watch a movie during dinner, like it on its on like a holiday movie together in the spirit or we don't, and we play games. That's nice.
Yeah.
I really believe in sort of the old-fashioned family. Love that with no electronics of any kind. Yeah, we have no phone. Engaging in conversation. No TV.
Totally. We have no phones or anything. But if it's the holidays and like all the cousins are over, I'll allow it. And we and we always do the peak and the pit of our day. That's what we would do with our dad every
dinner. That's my so if you book we used to call it Rose and Thorn but maybe that's good.
England. And yeah, yeah. Not so
good. Yeah. And then I go to bed early and are, you know, I started to drink a little bit in my at the age of 42. Very
nice. Yeah. Because you were not known
alcohol coffee and alcohol of this is you do bold new chapter. We're going to have some fun, let loose a little bit, you
know. So what is that like why why are you allowing yourself to let loose now?
Because why
not? You know I just feel like I work a lot and I focus really like all day after school then it's like product meetings and testing things, and packaging meetings and everything for skin then I always have some skims element. Yeah of course I mean we didn't even talk about that.
It's more at meetings at a time six hour meetings at a
time I'll do product
meetings and are you in? And at all, any or all of your businesses are you in?
Board meetings. Are you like one thing, right? So your
I'm and every board meeting I'm and every Fabrics meeting design meeting product meeting. I picked the campaigns for everything, I picked the talent, if it's not me. And it's for skims, even foreskin, I picked the models, they pick the photographer's, everything that we're doing, whether even a pop-up in the, the design, I'm always working closely with the team that I hire. Like, I have to see every last
thing. And are you involved in operations at all, or like, finding?
No. So,
A time not. So I have a great team that I trust that handles, everything, even from factories distribution, I will be there for any questions or
like in board meetings if we have any like issues
but as far as even and where we go in retail I'll be a part of that conversation but I once I sign off on something I do have a lot of trust in my team and so I've mainly focus on like marketing.
Aang design
Fabrics specially for skims. Like I'm still the fit model I have to try everybody still the fit
model for G level 2.
I'm so fun, it's
fun. Yeah it is. But I do feel stretched than sometimes I absolutely do. I mean you would have to and we didn't even talk about the private Equity thing. You're doing with Jay Salmons who I
love? Yes, I love him. He's so great. I mean, how great is this? I feel like I've been having these conversations with friends, especially a lot of my
Ends and like San Francisco that live and breathe this. And
yeah, we always
talk so much about how and why you want to invest in a company and what makes sense. And as you grow, you just different people around. You start to have these other kind of conversations and Jay and I have been talking for so long and when we talked about what we can do, it just was so exciting to me and is
it your Capital? Are you going to go raise? We're going to
raise.
Yeah, we're going to raise. And are you going to model too? I will. Yeah, of course I will J. Will we both really believe in it? I'm sure my family will fuck. Are you gonna have time to do all this? So I've already had so many meetings with so many companies that were interested in and that I'm so good at micro managing my time I really am but even just to
to maintain Focus to have the sort of brain cognition to be studying for the bar
once the but once was
It's schools done. My life will be so much easier and my time, I won't even know what to do with myself. Even if I'm if I have a Sunday off, like Courtney said, to me, you never sleep in and I'm like, you don't get that luxury with for little kids that just doesn't happen unless you're away on a vacation by yourself with no kids. So I just live my life that way and if I have an hour I'll dive into
Something else I just don't ever feel comfortable just like laying around doing nothing. So right my version of that has been to spend some time with my friends and have a drink and stay out a little bit later when I probably wouldn't have done that before. Even if I'm a little bit tired the next day in my work out just that time yes to has been summoned to be a
yeah a friend to laughter. Yeah. And and there is something about alcohol that you know I do.
No. It's like a great delineator between like the seriousness and the push of the day and then like, yeah, there's an exhale in it? Yeah, that's good. I don't
think I would do that on a daily. I'm not a Wine Drinker. What's your name isn't just tequila? Yeah. Just has to be like a little shot of pineapple and a shot of tequila. Perfect. Yeah, that's so good. I'm gonna have two shots, and I'm like, so good. It's
been fun. Thank you so much. This was so good. Yeah, good.
I've asked you 50 more questions easily akhil.
Thanks for listening to my conversation with Kim Kardashian.
Thanks for tuning in. This has been a presentation of cadence 13 Studios. I hope you'll listen, follow rate and review all of our episodes, which are available for free. On
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