Why Self-Esteem is a Fairweather Friend

Hi Elyse, lunan here. Co-host with Gwyneth of the goop podcast. Today's guest is Shauna Shapiro before we get to our conversation. I'd like to thank our friends at Celebrity Cruises who helped make today's episode possible.

Our travel editor went on a trip that redefined for us what cruising could be like it was with Celebrity Cruises, which is a modern luxury travel brand that has proven to be a very cool company to work with so much so that we just announced a major partnership with them called go Patsy. This is a wellness experience for an intimate group that will be part of an 11-day trip this August on the celebrity Apex which travels from Spain to France. So the Italian Riviera

on day five of the

crews all be sitting down with Gwyneth and asking her lots of questions about her personal Wellness.

Any a few very talented practitioners will lead guests through workshops for the mind body and soul and I'll close the day with a final conversation. There's a lot more going on with Celebrity Cruises and group Betsy. So if you're interested in learning more and checking out tickets had to celebrity cruises.com / goop at sea.

Don't hold anything too tightly just wish

for it one it let it come from the intention of real truth for you.

And then let it go.

The me. All Saul is like it's Unbound its Limitless, but we will use words to limit ourselves when people stop believing that somebody's got your back or Superman's coming we turn to ourselves and that's where you become empowered

Action attracts positive things I'm Gwyneth Paltrow. This is the goop podcast bringing together thought leaders culture Changers creatives Founders and CEOs scientists doctors healers and Seekers here to start conversations because simply asking questions and listening has the power to change the way we see the world.

Today is no exception. I'll let Elise fill you in on her extraordinary guest.

All right over to a lease.

Shauna Shapiro is a clinical psychologist. He focuses on mindfulness and self-compassion. She's the author of a new book called. Good morning. I love you today shapira teaches us the definition of mindfulness and reassures us that it's actually deceptively simple at its core. It's about being present in our moment-to-moment life because after all mindfulness is really about awareness and with practice we can learn to accept our emotions instead of fighting them and to become more compassionate with ourselves.

Importantly being mindful allows us to be with whatever is happening. It gives us a choice the real question that I think people should be asking themselves is what do I want to grow? Because that will guide you what do I want to grow? This is what you need to practice and we can practice in every moment of Our Lives.

Okay, let's get to my chat with Shauna Shapiro. So Shauna, I know you got into mindfulness when it before before it was trending across the world. And I know it had to do with your own sort of Journey of becoming trapped somewhere in your body. So do you want to sort of bring people up to speed on how this

happened? Yeah. It was it was really interesting actually because I was recently speaking in Latin America and

The person who introduced me as the speaker said, you know, she's been doing this before it was popular and I hadn't really thought about that but I was introduced to mindfulness when I was 17. I had had spinal fusion surgery for my scoliosis. And so I was in a hospital bed for many many months and rehabilitating through a lot of pain and also just a lot of loss. I'd been a volleyball player and I wasn't going to play volleyball again and

And I was introduced to mindfulness through my father and it was one of those moments in life where everything slows down and gets clear. And even though I was in a lot of physical pain something started to open up and it really set the course for my life. When I started my PhD program about five for six years later. I remember my advisor said well, I don't think you should study this you have such a promising academic.

And you're going to ruin it for yourself. And here we are 20 years later and mindfulness is probably one of the most important topics in Psychology and health right

Yeah, and I know and there's obviously incredible science and mounting science to support that mindfulness is a practice can affect everything from how we recover from disease to how we make decisions in the world to our happiness. Right? So, what is it because I feel like a lot of people hear it and they're like, oh, I don't want to meditate. How do you define it?

So mindfulness is deceptively simple right at the most.

Basic level mindfulness is about being present and it's not just a meditation practice. It's about being present in our daily moment-to-moment life, but the meditation practice helps kind of strengthen that muscle or that capacity to be present and yet mindfulness is much more than just paying attention or being present, you know, because otherwise a sniper could be the most mindful person in the world. They know how to focus their attention. So the way I Define mindfulness is it's about

three elements and one is paying attention. Of course that's important. In fact, if you notice if you're listening your mind may have already wandered off and that's natural our mind wanders about 47 percent of the time. This is a study done by Harvard. So about half of our life were kind of missing because we don't know how to pay attention. So the first step of mindfulness is just focusing our attention in the present moment and yet why we're paying attention is also really important. This is called our

Intention and this has to do with our values what we care about because if you think about how many distractions there are in life and how much input were receiving all the time. We have to stay really steady and what we actually care about what our priorities are. So I call this your intention what you value and this kind of sets the compass of your heart. It says this is the direction I want to head and then the final element of mindfulness is your attitude and this is how you pay attention.

What we begin to notice as we're paying attention is that we tend to be really judgmental and critical and so mindfulness is about paying attention with kindness with curiosity with openness so that we create the best learning environment and the best way to actually see things clearly the word mindfulness means to see clearly. So that's all we're trying to do. We're trying to see clearly what's happening in our lives so that we can respond effectively wisely.

The and it's funny. I mean mindfulness in some ways almost seems like a misnomer because I loved the parts of the book to where you talk about sort of bringing it to the body. Right and the way that we contemplate what we're eating or what we're actually feeling in our and ourselves like having you talk about sort of making full body decisions which in some ways, of course, it starts at the mind that's like it starts with the inquiry of why it is this. Give me

A pit in my stomach or why is my chest tight but in a way it's almost like a dissociation from the mind right? Because I think I live in my moon. So many of us are stuck in our minds. It's like when you're when you're sort of being pushed for mindfulness, you're like, I don't really want to spend any more time in my mind than I already do.

You're making a really important point which is mindfulness is an embodiment practice and when we say the word mine were not talking about kind of

Not limiting it to your brain mind is kind of your awareness. And what's interesting is that the word for mind and heart is the same in Asian languages which mindfulness stems from ancient Asian Traditions. So mindfulness could be translated as heartfulness.

And when I'm practicing for me, in fact even just right now as I'm speaking with you I'm staying connected to my body really softening the body feeling my breath feeling my heart feeling my mind. So it's this kind of hole being practice where we bring all of ourselves to the present moment. And that's really the miracle of mindfulness is that everything is included everything is welcome. We have all of our resources available to meet each

That I love the idea of even rebranding it as heartfulness because I feel like there are so many things that have become trending and people think that they understand it myself included and then they sort of categorize it and and miss the point. I'm

so happy that you're bringing this up because this for me, you know, I've been studying mindfulness personally, but also academically for 20 years and I feel like my mission is to clarify what it actually is because

as I think people do miss the point with mindfulness with self-care and it becomes kind of a caricature of itself and it really loses its transformational power. So to be clear mindfulness is really about paying attention with kindness with compassion and with curiosity so we actually get interested. Where were these were almost like children were we're learning constantly and we meet something and we don't automatically judge it as bad even something like sadness.

Or fear instead of pushing it away or fighting against it we become curious about it and we welcome it and we say, oh sweetheart. You're a little sad right now. What does that feel like and what this does is it actually creates the best learning environment for us to heal for us to learn for us to grow and for us to change and I think that's kind of the miracle of mindfulness is that it it allows us to be with whatever's happening no matter

What it is,

let's say idea to of like what has what is happening or what has happened happened, right like the story Utah of like the parable of a teacher taking his students and pointing on a boulder and asking them how heavy it is and they say, oh very heavy and he says we'll only if you try to pick it

up exactly and mindfulness gives us a choice. It says you have Choice over what you think you have Choice over your actions your behaviors and the only way that you have

Is if you're aware if you're present and so what mindfulness does is it provides this incredible space between the stimulus whatever's happening to you and the response and in that space lies our choice and our freedom,

so we're not just it's not a reaction right exactly a turd right outer. So like when you talk about judgment which obviously, you know, particularly women, I think we all lob judgment on ourselves and we

ourselves about how mindful we are as well. Where does that come from? Like where are the Des associations and sort of who we are is that just what we've sort of been programmed or trained to value or believe is

true, right? Well, I agree with you. I think I think this judgmental kind of feeling shame. I think it's Universal. I think all of us experience it and that was one of my huge realizations when I started as a therapist and clinical work is everyone I was working with

There they were high level CEOs or women with breast cancer or stressed out college students. They were all talking about the same thing. This tremendous self-judgment this tremendous sense of I'm not living my life, right? I'm not doing it right. There's something wrong with me and I knew what they were talking about because of course, I feel that too. We all do this self judgement is universal and I think this is one of the powers of mindfulness is that

first it allows us to start to see our self judgement we start to notice it and then it allows us to begin to soften because the instructions of mindfulness the very essence of mindfulness is to love yourself to be kind to yourself to accept yourself. And I think this is the fundamental ingredient for change, you know, so often we feel stuck on our life that we've missed our chance or we've messed up or that it's too late and so we judge and we beat ourselves.

Of that and we kind of feel like there's no hope like we can't change but science shows that it's never too late to change. I mean, this is the whole essence of neuroplasticity is that we can restructure our brain in any moment. The brain is constantly changing throughout our life. So, I believe the reason we don't change is because most of us are missing this essential ingredient of self-compassion.

We think that we're supposed to be perfect. We think we're not supposed to make mistakes. We think we're doing it wrong and then we shame and judge ourselves. And what science shows is that when we shame ourselves, we literally shut down the Learning Centers of the brain. We rob ourselves of the resources. We need to change and so self-compassion. Is this incredible alternative because not only is it comforting and makes us feel better. It also bathes our system with dopamine.

Turns on our Learning Centers and our motivation centers and gives us the resources. We need to change.

We'll get back to Shauna Shapiro and just a

Some of the most interesting and compelling collaborations we've done at group have been the most unexpected and I already know that go Patsy will fall into that category goop Betsy is A New Wellness experience that we're doing on a wait for it cruise ship. It's a partnership with modern luxury brand Celebrity Cruises and it's going down this August on board the celebrity Apex this ship departs from Barcelona.

And hits the French Riviera and the Italian Riviera over the course of 11 days for an intimate group of gas participating in Cupid. See the trip will also include a very cool and unique Wellness Journey Midway through the trip will be hosting a series of workshops and classes designed to explore mental physical and spiritual well-being and surprise Gwyneth and I will be on board for Seaside conversation, which will likely be pretty wild this

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trip is unlike any Wellness or travel experience that I could have dreamed of just a few years.

Ago or even a year ago, there's many more components to get Betsy, which I don't have time to share here. But you can learn more about the experience the available tickets and Celebrity Cruises in general if you had to celebrity cruises.com scoop at Sea,

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Back to my chat with Shauna Shapiro.

I like the idea of rebranding self-care self-compassion to that's really sort of what it what's at the root of it. Right? And while I think socially we dismiss self-care is vain or silly or trite. I think you know what ultimately like the goal of it or the idea of it is that we have to love ourselves first. Otherwise, how can we possibly

He loved and he went off and I loved the part of the book where you distinguish between self compassion and self-esteem and how by pegging our sort of our successes and our life to self esteem and healthy self-esteem. We end up really writing a roller coaster.

Right exactly. Right? Self-esteem is a fair-weather friend. It's your best friend when things are going well, but desserts you when you're really struggling when you actually

We need that friend and that's why self-compassion is so powerful is that it's our constant Ally, right it goes with us wherever we go and it says I care about you and kind of holds your hand through the hard times. But what I think so important to know in the science of self-compassion is it's not just soothing it's it's actually alchemical in the sense that it gives us the resources. We need to face hard situations and the resources we need to change.

Research on self-compassion is really compelling. It shows that people are who are self-compassionate. They're more successful. They have better relationships. They actually take care of themselves better. So they exercise more they go to the doctors more, you know often when I tell people about self-compassion they kind of roll their eyes. They're like, I'm just going to become a couch potato and I'm never going to change. I'm just going to get lazy and lose my Edge, but the exact opposite is true that when we care about ourselves we take

Care of ourselves we exercise we eat. Well, we do our best work. We take risks. We're not afraid to fail because failure doesn't mean you know that I'm going to beat myself up and it means I'm going to try again because I have faith in

myself. And how do you I know you have tools for creating that paradigm shift because you know, this is certainly true for me. There are things that I would happily do for people in my life whether you know friends or colleagues or my children or my husband that I would never

Do for myself or never expect anyone to do for me, right? Yes. So how do you coach people towards viewing themselves as worthy of that sort of attention and

effort. Yeah. It's such a great question. So a couple things first is it doesn't happen overnight that it's really important for people to understand that change happens in small steps. Right? I mean, we're not supposed to be perfect. Perfect is the antithesis of evolution.

And so if we're growing and changing we're doing it in small steps. And so the key is practice and its daily practice now in terms of Shifting the Paradigm. This is really interesting for me. So when I first began studying self-compassion, I would I would when I would do it with myself, but also with my students and my clients I would say well, what would what would a dear friend say to you if you're in the situation and what was interesting is that didn't work at all because they were just like yeah.

Yeah, yeah, whatever. They would say. It's okay, or you're nice. So then I switched it and I said if your dear friend or your daughter or your husband was in this situation, what would you say to them? And that is what shifts the Paradigm because all of a sudden they think about the person they care about right? So maybe think about your child right now and if they were feeling really lonely or they were suffering how would you comfort them and all of a sudden your whole physiology changes in her like, how can I help?

And so what I say to people is treat yourself like you would treat a dear friend just imagine it and do it five percent more 5% more kindness 5% more compassion. It's a process. It's a practice. It does not happen overnight, but something really wonderful happened for me a few months ago. I was teaching and I was in front of everyone and I dropped a chair on my foot. And normally I would be like, oh, you're such a klutz or

So stupid or you know, and my reaction was actually all sweetheart that hurt you know, and and I said it out loud. I was like, oh ouch sweetheart and people started laughing and they're like, wow, you're really practicing What You Preach because there was this kindness toward myself. And so I think as we practice every day both formerly in the meditation practice and in moments in our life, it starts to grow and this is really kind of my key teaching which is what you practice grows.

This is the essence of Neuroscience and neuroplasticity. Whatever you practice grows stronger, we can actually sculpt and strengthen our synaptic connections based on repeated practice. And so the real question that I think people should be asking themselves is what do I want to grow? Because that will guide you what do I want to grow? This is what you need to practice and we can practice in every moment of Our Lives because in every moment we're growing and shape.

Our brain

right and you talk about sort of to how for negative experiences were velcro and for positive experiences were tough on right exactly that there are ways. Yeah, go

ahead and that's from dr. Rick Hansen who is a dear friend and colleague. And basically we have evolved with something called the negativity bias, which means that we tend to focus on what's wrong what were afraid of what could possibly happen and evolutionarily this

AdSense right. We are the descendants of the people who when the leaves rustled in the bushes. They ran away, right? They were anxious. They were afraid the the ones who are kind of mellow and we're like, oh I want to pet the Pretty Kitty they didn't survive. So we are hard-wired to look for the danger and the negative but this negativity bias is really not a great way to live. And so part of what we can practice is cultivating more joy more gratitude.

And begin to Prime the mind to focus on beauty. So one of my favorite practices that I wrote about in the book is to wake up in the morning and do what I call the miracle morning question, which is I wonder what magical and surprising thing will happen today.

and what this does is it really Prime's the mind to look for the good to look for the wonderful to look for the surprising and what I notice is it motivates me and as I'm going through my day, it kind of inspires this curiosity of like I wonder what surprising thing will happen because we have no idea there's infinite possibilities in every moment if we can stay open

and openness and and receptivity I think is so hard for so many

For myself included to even just take in the good things right whether it's a compliment or a laugh or something fun and surprising like it's so I think when people are trying to give us things we often try and immediately reflect it back right like Ping Pong, but you talked about how in those moments like three three deep breaths. Can you sort of explain how that

works? Exactly? So you're making a really good point which is we have a lot of

Trouble taking in the good or valuing the good both when someone gives us a compliment or even when we're having a lovely experience. We kind of move on to the next thing and we don't actually receive the goodness and the nourishment of that moment and one of the things that can be helpful is to pause and take three deep breaths. It takes about 20 to 30 seconds to encode a positive experience in our long-term memory negative experiences. We just

Lock in because you know, we want to remember that, you know scary thing happened. So it never happens again, but positive experiences that kind of just fade away. And so if we can pause when something beautiful is happening and really take that in take three deep breaths and pay attention to the sensory experience. So for example, I was recently at Thanksgiving with my son and he was laughing with his cousins and it just it brought me so much joy, and I paused in that moment.

And I actually heard and felt the energy of his laughter and I took three deep breaths because I really wanted to remember that he recently went away to school. And so I'm not with him. I'm not living with him for the first time in our lives and I have that moment though. It's in it's part of me now and that's what our memories are. They become part of our chemical soup. And so we can start to store good and healthy memories instead of just negative ones will get back to Michael bigger Rita.

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Back to my chat with Shauna Shapiro.

One of the central points of your book is really to slow down. Right? I love that story of I miss this viral moment, I guess in the news of the concert being a violinist who was playing like on a stradivari 3.5 million times violin on the street and only seven people stopped to listen, right?

Tonight 32 dollars

or something like that. He made $32 when his concert tickets cost a hundred dollars per ticket and it showed it was this incredible illustration. The video is so powerful to watch I show it to my students at the University, but it showed he's sitting there playing this Exquisite violin piece and people are just rushing by and we don't take the time to pause and stop. We don't even notice the beauty around us because we're so busy getting from here to there and

Part of mindfulness is about slowing down and you know often I'm teaching and corporations and working with a lot of top Executives. And when I say the word slow down they kind of tuned out there like nah, she doesn't understand my life. And so what I want to explain is that slowing down doesn't necessarily mean that you have to go a lot slower. You know, I have been a single mom for 10 years and had a full career and so there was a lot of stuff that I had to do fast and quickly but

What I noticed is I could slow down my interior experience so that it wasn't so urgent so that I wasn't so hurried and there was space and breath even as I was walking really quickly to the airport and so slowing down for me is both when you can move slower because you notice so much more but also internally to take that pressure off.

Yeah, and I think we all need coaches and guides and that I mean in my own personal therapy, I work with a sort of young yeah.

And somatic EMDR therapist who's amazing and he's constantly, you know I get in there and I'm like blah blah blah blah blah blah. He's like stop like what's happening slow down and what's happening in your body and then suddenly sort of I'm in tears. I think we we hurry right like we rush and part to gloss over we missed the beautiful and we have but we also do it to gloss over the pain right and

And like if we don't consider it it didn't happen. Even though I think science would also support that it stays in our

bodies rightly the body remembers?

Yeah. And so, how do you I know we talked about this a little bit already but in that a disassociation sort of like Riri Association, I guess with what's your body is telling you how do you coach people for

And it's this is a really important point because what happens is we almost don't have time to deal with all the stress and pain and difficulty. And so we just repress and stuff it and what mindfulness does is creates this space and for me I practice every day. So it creates the space every day where I can kind of empty out the pain and the trauma and really hold it like you would hold a young child or a little baby and hold the tears and hold the fear.

Here and say sweetheart. I'm here and for me, it's this purification process where every single day I'm cleaning out and then I can meet life more fully and so for when I work with people I first of all I always begin in Stillness. So when someone walks in we don't immediately start talking about what stressful in their life we pause we feel our bodies we feel our heart we set Our intention what's important? What do I care about? And

And we move and we work from here one of my favorite quotes from Einstein. He says the Consciousness that created the problem is not the Consciousness that can solve it. What mindfulness does is it begins to shift our Consciousness and so we begin to see our challenges and our difficulties from a different perspective and we begin to see ourselves and life from a different perspective and that changes everything

it also seems like in slowing.

Down and thinking about it like almost in some ways through self-compassion forcing you to value your experience because I think to so many of us Pain Scale everything right? So it's like well, this isn't I have nothing to complain about this isn't a big deal compared to this like person's travails or tragedies. Like I have nothing and so we sort of denigrate ourselves. And also I think turn all of these practices

Two things that are silly or self-indulgent and I know you gave a tedx talk about this right like that overcoming that sort of that a version to the earnestness of even giving yourself. The consideration is a

big hurdle, right? Absolutely. I think it's so challenging for us to forgive ourselves. It's so challenging for us to let go of our mistakes.

And one of the things that I spoke about in my tedx talk was a patient that I was working with at the Veterans Hospital who had actually been in the Vietnam War. This was many years ago, and he I was leading a group for men with post-traumatic stress disorder and he was carrying such tremendous shame that at one point in the group. He raised his hand and he said I don't want to get better.

I don't deserve to get better. He said what I saw in the war and what I did I don't deserve to get better and then he proceeded to tell us all of the horrible things that he had witnessed and and that he had done.

And what was so amazing as he was speaking and you could feel his shame is the other men in the group were holding him with such compassion so much tenderness, they they felt his pain and they didn't judge him. They acknowledged what he had done was wrong, but they recognized that this wasn't who he truly was and as he witnessed and experienced their compassion, you could feel something in him begin to shift and this possibility of

Passion for himself and forgiveness for himself began to open and after many months he actually began to allow himself to feel that compassion to feel that forgiveness and witnessing. His transformation was so powerful and so inspiring to me because it shows it shows you that all of us have the capacity to change all of us have the capacity to hold ourselves with greater.

compassion and greater kindness and and sometimes it requires other people other people re teaching us our loveliness reteaching us our own worth so that we can find it again within

ourselves and then share it right because I feel like so yeah so much of the pain that we express and sort of put on other people is really our own unexpressed pain or or like not are having a dearth of love because we don't love

Solve the knife to have anything left to share right? And so it's hard to not feel resentful of what other people have so we can't we can't on that note. We can't wrap this up without talking about good morning. I love you and even that practice of starting your day and that way and so can you sort of talk people through how how that started for you and evolved

and absolutely I am so

important so we'll it really

Han many years ago when I was going through my divorce and it was a very difficult time in my life and I would wake up each morning with this pit of Shame and self-doubt judgment and fear and my meditation teacher suggested. I began a practice of self compassion. She suggested I say, I love you Shana every day and I thought to myself no way. It just sounded so new-agey and hippie-dippy. It just it just wasn't

Didn't feel resonant. So she said how about just saying good morning Shawna, you know begin your day with some kindness and she said try putting your hand on your heart when you say it it releases oxytocin. It's good for you. She knew the science would win me over so the next morning I woke up put my hand on my heart took a breath and said good morning Shawna and it was kind of nice right instead of that Avalanche of Shame and stuff judgment. I just greeted myself with kindness.

And I continued to practice every day and a few months later. I was actually at esalen Institute in Big Sur, and it was my birthday and it was the first birthday at had without my son or husband and I was all alone and I woke up that morning, but my hand on my heart and said good morning. I love you Shauna happy birthday, and it was as if this Dam burst around my heart and I felt this.

I felt my grandmother's love. I felt my mother's love. I felt my own self love.

And I wish I could tell you every day since then has been this bubble of self-love and that's not true. But what is true is this pathway of kindness was established and it's growing stronger and I practice every morning every morning. I wake up. I put my hand on my heart. I say good morning. I love you Shauna and you know some days it feels raw and tender and lonely and some days. It feels magical and this deep.

Love and some days. I just feel nothing but I keep practicing because as we know what you practice grows stronger, and so I began teaching this practice to my students at the University to my family to my clients. And and then as you saw I talked about it in my tedx talk so now over a million and a half people of learn this practice and I wrote a book called. Good morning. I love you mindfulness and self compassion practices to rewire.

Oh the brain what's funny is it's actually coming out now. It's coming out in the United States in January and it's coming out at the United Kingdom Edition and I just got the cover for it yesterday and they change the title to say rewire your mind instead of good morning. I love you. I think good morning. I love you didn't quite translate in British.

But the essence of it is the science behind self-compassion the science behind mindfulness and how all of us have the capacity to change how it's never too late. No matter what our past no matter what our current circumstances it's never too late to cultivate a happier healthier life and that's really the goal. And the intention of the book is to provide people with a roadmap.

To say here's how you can practice here are simple powerful scientifically proven practices that can help bring about lasting

change and I love the idea to of like how you can take good morning. I love you and then sort of good morning. I love you to all the people in your life friend or Foe.

Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean people roll their eyes at me a little bit because every text I send every email. I always say good morning. I love you and it

It's really become the special way of connecting with my friends my family my community and in also with difficult people like you said I wrote about in my book how there was a moment when I realized, you know, I'd begun sending good morning. I love you out to everyone in the world to all beings and then I realized I wasn't sending it to my ex-husband and that I could even practice sending it to him. And that part of good morning. I love you is this forgiveness practice and this acceptance practice?

Where we choose consciously to see the good and this doesn't mean that we paper over difficult feelings or difficult circumstances. In fact, I want to make really clear that mindfulness and self-compassion are not about passive resignation. They're not about okay you can do whatever you want. There are real things in this world that must change and what I find is that these practices actually give us the motivation and the power and the courage to face.

Challenging situations and to stand up for social injustice and to demand change. I think that's what's so powerful about them is you realize as you practice that you're never just practicing for yourself that everything we do has echoes in the universe. And so every time we're practicing where we're actually also changing the world exactly.

We can all bring a little bit more love to it. Absolutely.

So good morning. I love you Shauna good.

Meaning. I love you.

Thanks for listening to my conversation with Shauna Shapiro. For more on Shauna had to dr. Shauna Shapiro.com. That's sha un a sh a Piro or check out the stories with done with her at group.com the podcast and make sure to get a copy of

her book. Good morning. I love you,

which is out January 28th.